Chopin Music Forum

[Goldberg]

Yeah, it's a great site, and has a ton of potential...unless you hate Liszt, I suppose, but so far no one here has expressed such feelings (good thing, too). It seems like a while ago there was a rather significant group of people on various forums who took every opportunity to trash Liszt...but then again, maybe that was just on PianoWorld's forums. If there was ever a larger concentration of conceited, arrogant, and dogmatic people in an internet forum......well, it would be an enormous surprise to me.

*COUGH* anyway...(mean streak no. 2, Erik, heh). I didn't know you were looking for texts. I might just consider that! I'm not the best writer in the world, but certainly I'll help out more with articles than with recordings, haha...now if only I had an encyclopedic knowledge of Liszt like you.

[Helling]

I would be happy for any help. Actually I realised this post is making the topic drift away so I will open a new one about it.

[Nocturneguy]

OH MY GOD!!!!! NOONE EVEN MENTIONED SONETTO DEL PETRARCA!!!!!!!!! ARE YALL HIGH?????????
My faves are HR2, Sonetto, Lizst-Schubert Valse, Totentanz, Sonata in B minor, Campanella...I dont like liszt that much, sry for this, but i think his music is empty virtuosity...

[Goldberg]

That's a common criticism, but really I don't see any real verisimilitude in it. Besides, given your comment, it seems *to me* that you're just listening to the "wrong" pieces anyway--although I personally love Totentanz, and, well, ok so I think poorly of HR2 and Campanella (and don't like the Sonetto much, and have never thoroughly enjoyed the Sonata either), I don't see much musical quality in the piece or some of the others you mentioned. The Transcendental Etudes are a good place to go to hear Liszt's most accessible original piano works, but also check out his song/opera/symphony transcriptions, his Chorales for piano, his Years of Pilgrimage (from which the Sonetto comes, I believe, though I can't remember which book--I actually haven't heard the complete work myself), and his non-piano work as well, like the Faust/Dante Symphonies, Symphonic Poems, Choral works (like the Requiem and Coronation Masses; these are "interesting" works as Erik and I have agreed, and of a certain intellectual property, but perhaps not his best works), and organ pieces as well. There is some fascinating stuff out there, and to me considering his extraordinary depth and range, claims that Liszt is one of the most influential Romantic composers are quite justified. Just when you think you've seen/heard it all, he throws something new at you to uncover!

Sure, he had his bag of tricks, but he was a supreme virtuoso with performance demands! Part of his genius consisted of his ability to make the pieces accessible to the pianist, which he was a master of, and also to the audience, which he also exceled at. His transcendental abilities, most apparent in his enormous operatic and symphonic transcriptions, never cease to amaze me.

I think someone of some significance once said that if a listener finds any vulgarity in Liszt, it is not a fault of the composer but a fault of the performer. There are plenty of bad pianists who don't "get" Liszt. Just remember: Cziffra was not one of them! (Hamelin could be considered one, though; of course, his Liszt is more musical than some, but to me it just sounds and looks (on video) too easy in his hands, or too calculated, or whatever. Liszt and Hamelin don't mix well, though the story is different for Alkan, Godowsky, well, you know the rest...)

[Max]

His playing is very calculated, and he has the technique so dialled that it doesn't have the excitement (as a pianist who might not necessarily struggle, but is certainly wary of the risks of derailing)

[An!ma`]

Adding Spanish Rhapsody and Totentanz to my favourites.

[Max]

The Spanish Rhapsody has to be the best. piece. ever.

[Scriabinist]

I don't like the Spanish Rhapsody much. The beginning is great but then it just kind of repeats itself.

My new favourite piece is HR10, after I heard a great rendition of it in the Liszt competition.

[Goldberg]

Yeah, lately I haven't really had a "favourite Liszt piece" for as much as I like the music. I'm really into all the Rhapsodies, now, except I STILL don't like no. 2 or no. 15 very much. HR 10 is definitely awesome.

I'd probably say that right now the ones I like the most are basically: The TEs (especially no. 10, no. 12), PEs (considering I'm trying to play the 2nd one, I've become rather obsessed with those), The "Norma" Fantasy, "Niobe" Fantasy, "Sonnambula" Fantasy, Polonaise from Eugen Onegin transcription, the Waltz from Gounod's Faust opera....oh! and how could I forget? The Rigoletto Paraphrase and the Tannhauser Overture...

The Spanish Rhapsody is certainly awesome, but I agree it gets a "little bit long" towards the end. Sort of like Islamey...I'd kinda like to learn the SR someday, though, just for kicks.

Has the Clochette Fantasy been brought up already? What does everyone think of that?

[Nocturneguy]

When people think of Liszt they think of this gigantic techinique (which he had) and nothing else. When performers play Liszt they want to WOW the public and not coax it with musical qualities. It's all bang bang and no good phrasing, legato, good tempo...I hope you guys understnad what i am trying to say...

[SteinwayModelD]

[Mephisto]

[Baudelaire]

Sonata
2nd Ballade
La Norma Paraphrase
Lugubre gondole n.2
Benediction de Dieu dans la sollitude
Annees de Pelerinage: Rome

However I think the 2 Concertos do not deserve the acclaim they have today: I personally the music he wrote at this period of his life is far inferior to what he wrote after...

[Max]

I agree with what you said about the Concerti. I don't understand the 2nd, and the 1st has its moments but it's not really satisfying like some of the other big romantic ones are.