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Wagner

Music composed between 1815 and 1910, excluding Chopin: Liszt, Mendelssohn, etc.
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Answer after reading my post.

Poll ended at 22 Oct 2005, 13:41

It should be played?
3
75%
No it shouldn't
1
25%
 
Total votes : 4

Wagner

Postby tom bobby » 22 Sep 2005, 13:41

I may be be moving off the topic of Romantic Music with this (drifting off to the world of philosophy), but I hope you find this intresting nonetheless.

Wagner was an anti-semite for those of you who dont know. Do you think his music should be played at a holocaust memorial if yes, why? If not, why not? How far does one go distinguish (as it were) between ones music and the composers morally inexcusable views?

Is it wrong for a Jewish person to listen to Wagners music? I mean the Nazi's certianly thought so, they were obsessed with Wagner and I'm quite sure they would have killed someone for listening to Mahler; similarly should one ban Tchaikovsky's music becuase it is "unnatural"? (Tchaikovsky was a homosexual and many view homosexuality as unnatural)

Is Music created, or is that merely an illusion? Was (is) music always there waiting to be "discovered".

I personally think Wagners music should be allowed to be played at a holocuast memorial, we should not sink down to same level as the Nazis and ban Wagner's music. A man may be an evil maniac but he cant spread his evil on to the music he writes.
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Postby Fryderyk » 22 Sep 2005, 16:37

I don´t know much about Wagner, but to ban his music would be insane. Keep in mind that he was not alone with his thoughts regarding jews and so on.

Perhaps the content of his operas can have a message that doesn´t appeal to everyone, but I think you are too sensitive if you are offended by the music and the words of Wagner.

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Postby Nocturneguy » 22 Sep 2005, 22:04

Cortot hated jews...I hate the man but I love the musician...heh...
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Postby tom bobby » 23 Sep 2005, 16:12

Good points.
The thing is, you cant convey a message in Music, while in other art forms (such as painting and drawing) one can put a rascist message across.
I alsot think Wagner is a very arrogant man, he once said of Chopin:
"He is a composer for the right hand only" He thinks it to be more significant what hand the music is played in rather than what the music sounds like.
Wagner is a very arrogant, proud anti-semite. But I shan't sink to his level and judge his music by the views he held.
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Postby Nocturneguy » 23 Sep 2005, 20:30

tom bobby wrote:I alsot think Wagner is a very arrogant man, he once said of Chopin:
"He is a composer for the right hand only"


I have never heard Wagner, and now I really won't. Lol, he bashed my FAVE composer...A-hole...Is he crazy??? right hand only???? wtf???? maybe it was he who played only the right hand parts, because he is clearly deaf to the left hand melodies...
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Postby Techneut » 02 Jan 2006, 15:36

I don't think Wagner was as bad as he's sometimes depicted. Yes he was anti-semitic, but not rabidly so - in fact some of his closest friends were Jewish. Keep in mind that many people back then had similar feelings (Chopin being one). Yes he was an arrogant sod, apt to say unkind things about other composers - again, hardly unsual. That the Nazis used his music as an icon should not be held against him.

Whatever you think of Wagner as a person and his place in history, do not let it stand in the way of appreciation of his music. Even if you do not like opera, his ouvertures and orchestral parts are breathtaking, and it is hard not be swept away by the music's gorgeous beauty once you open your mind to it.
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Re:

Postby pianola » 19 Oct 2007, 11:47

Nocturneguy wrote:
tom bobby wrote:I alsot think Wagner is a very arrogant man, he once said of Chopin:
"He is a composer for the right hand only"


I have never heard Wagner, and now I really won't. Lol, he bashed my FAVE composer...A-hole...Is he crazy??? right hand only???? wtf???? maybe it was he who played only the right hand parts, because he is clearly deaf to the left hand melodies...


I agree. I never really liked Wagner. Even though he is very brilliant. but he how dare he call Chopin's music "for right hand only" ! he is deaf to the beautiful left hand parts of Chopin.
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Re: Wagner

Postby Brewtality » 12 Nov 2007, 00:30

Wagner was a genius and I love his operas.
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