Performances of the Berceuse in Db

[Mark Smith]

Hey all,

My name is Mark Smith and I am studying for the final year of my Music Degree at King's College London.

Part of my course is 'Performance Practice on Record' which follows how performance practices have changed, how this can be seen through recordings and even how the invention of recorded sound and its development has lead to a change in performance practices.

I have to write a 5000 word research paper for this course and I have chosen Chopin as my subject matter. There is an article I read regarding Chopin's use of virtuosity in his compositions; whether it was there for pure show-off or whether in fact it was an integral part of the music. (particularly the Bercuese, due to the fact it was a Lullaby, virtuosity cannot occur because of the pieces genre - it has to be musically important).

So I am trying to find more information to back this up, as well as recordings of the Bercuese which can illustrate it. I am particularly looking for extreme performances, ones which may be particularly fast or slow, or some which are overly virtuosic or really play down the difficulty.
If you have any suggestions or ideas I'd be most grateful!

Many thanks, Mark Smith

[Nocturneguy]

one word...Cortot...ill try to get it here for u...casnt promise tho

[Mark Smith]

one word...Cortot...ill try to get it here for u...casnt promise tho

Great, thanks so much! Why Cortot?

[Nocturneguy]

Well, I guess Cortot would be a good idea because of his rubato...he rly speeds up in some parts, but lets wait for other ppl to give their opinions...

[Mark Smith]

Well, I guess Cortot would be a good idea because of his rubato...he rly speeds up in some parts, but lets wait for other ppl to give their opinions...

Ok, thats great. I'm going to head to the library today to try and find a few recordings, but I would still love to hear peoples opinions.
Many thanks. Mark

[MindenBlues]

Hey all,

My name is Mark Smith and I am studying for the final year of my Music Degree at King's College London.

Part of my course is 'Performance Practice on Record' which follows how performance practices have changed, how this can be seen through recordings and even how the invention of recorded sound and its development has lead to a change in performance practices.

I have to write a 5000 word research paper for this course and I have chosen Chopin as my subject matter. There is an article I read regarding Chopin's use of virtuosity in his compositions; whether it was there for pure show-off or whether in fact it was an integral part of the music. (particularly the Bercuese, due to the fact it was a Lullaby, virtuosity cannot occur because of the pieces genre - it has to be musically important).

So I am trying to find more information to back this up, as well as recordings of the Bercuese which can illustrate it. I am particularly looking for extreme performances, ones which may be particularly fast or slow, or some which are overly virtuosic or really play down the difficulty.
If you have any suggestions or ideas I'd be most grateful!

Many thanks, Mark Smith

Mark, I highly recommend that you read the book "Chopin - as seen by his pupils" by Eigeldinger (if you have not done yet). It is based only on facts and shows very valuable insights how Chopin teached and how he prepared himself for a performance: He enclosed in his room for several days, never practised his own performance pieces, instead Bach WTC preludes&fugues up and down...

I agree that Cortot may be a good source for historical recordings. You could consider recordings from Rachmaninoff who played several Chopin pieces, those recording dates are even earlier (around 1925?) and his interpretation is considerable different from nowadays interpretations.

However beside changes in taste caused by given expectation values for a recording (based on famous recordings, for Berceuse you could also consider Arthur Rubinstein) there are differences based on different characters of the artists. So also time independent.

Regarding virtuosity and Berceuse as Lullaby: In my opinion it is the most difficult thing on piano to play runs fast, smooth but pianissimo. Much more demanding than to play them forte. Do you play the Berceuse yourself? Than try to play the right hand runs without loosing the groove and remain pianissimo. Lord, how I wish to hear Chopin itself playing this!

[Mark Smith]

Mark, I highly recommend that you read the book "Chopin - as seen by his pupils" by Eigeldinger (if you have not done yet). It is based only on facts and shows very valuable insights how Chopin teached and how he prepared himself for a performance: He enclosed in his room for several days, never practised his own performance pieces, instead Bach WTC preludes&fugues up and down...

I agree that Cortot may be a good source for historical recordings. You could consider recordings from Rachmaninoff who played several Chopin pieces, those recording dates are even earlier (around 1925?) and his interpretation is considerable different from nowadays interpretations.

However beside changes in taste caused by given expectation values for a recording (based on famous recordings, for Berceuse you could also consider Arthur Rubinstein) there are differences based on different characters of the artists. So also time independent.

Regarding virtuosity and Berceuse as Lullaby: In my opinion it is the most difficult thing on piano to play runs fast, smooth but pianissimo. Much more demanding than to play them forte. Do you play the Berceuse yourself? Than try to play the right hand runs without loosing the groove and remain pianissimo. Lord, how I wish to hear Chopin itself playing this!

Hi, Thank you so much for your help here. I will look into this book and see what it says. I have acquired a few recordings, but I will definitely look out for a performance by Rachmaninoff.

Thank you again. Mark

[MindenBlues]

I had found mp3 files from Rachmaninoff on a russian website, but do not have any link anymore. If necessary, you can send me a PM including your email address, so I could sent you some mp3 files from Rachmanioff who plays Chopin (unfortunately not Berceuse). The mp3 files are of poor quality, but the original source is probably also not much better.

The mentioned book from Eigeldinger is really great, but focuses more on the teaching methods and interpretation hints from Chopin instead own performing. The Berceuse is also mentioned on several places. However, for your study and if you like to play Chopin yourself, this is the best book about his playing style I have found so far (and I have some...).